This interview is published in the May/June SPIDER-MAN issue of SCREENTALK magazine.

John J. Sakmar And Kerry Lenhart

Television’s Best Kept Secret

By Constance M. Burge

They’ve created 2 television series. Written 15 pilots (7 produced). Written and produced for 14 television shows. One look at their resume–it’s filled with every writing credit even possible in Hollywood–and you realize that these two guys have not only earned their way to the top, they’ve been able to stay there because they can seemingly write anything. Medical shows, legal shows, Sci-Fi, mysteries, action-adventure, nighttime soaps, romantic comedies … there literally is no genre this writing team hasn’t written and produced. In fact, they’ve worked non-stop for over sixteen years (an unbelievable track record for writers) and on some of television’s most popular series: "Boston Public," "Ally McBeal," "Judging Amy," "Chicago Hope," "MacGyver" and "Early Edition."

Meet television’s best kept secret: John J. Sakmar and Kerry Lenhart.

John J. Sakmar was born in Detroit, Michigan, but being a "hotel brat" (his father was an Innkeeper for Holiday Inn), John moved around quite a bit. He graduated from the University of Missouri with a journalism degree from the School of Journalism.

Kerry Lenhart, the son of a wheat farmer from Ritzville, Washington (pop. 1876), transferred from Washington State University to USC where he graduated from the School of Cinema/Television with a B.A. in Film Production.

Today, they both live in Los Angeles, where they are writers and current Co-Executive Producers of David E. Kelley’s sophomore hit, "Boston Public."

You two met when you were Pages at NBC. When did you decide to work together?

John: You could only be a Page for eighteen months. So everyone in the program was aspiring to their next job, whether it be acting, writing or directing. Kerry was (is) an aspiring director. I was an aspiring network programmer (don’t ask). Both of us were told that writing was the way to get where we wanted to go. I had never seen a script, let alone written one. So I asked Kerry, the film school grad, for help.

Kerry: We wrote a spec script for an NBC show called "Father Murphy." Nothing happened with it and that was the end of the partnership. John then decided to write a spec script for "Remington Steele." However, there was a problem. He didn’t have an idea. I supplied him with one. He then refused to use the idea unless we wrote the script together. We did. It was that spec script that became our first script sale. Though we had not planned it, we were now officially partners.

Your first staff job was on "Remington Steele." How’d that happen?

Kerry: While I was a production assistant on "Remington Steele," John and I were able to write two freelance episodes that were filmed. That made the transition to staff writer, for the most part, a comfortable one because we had already had the opportunity to meet and work with Michael Gleason, the Executive Producer, and the writing staff. Still, we suddenly felt the pressure of being full-time writers who could be cut loose in ten weeks if we failed to prove ourselves useful.

One day Michael Gleason–sensing we were stressed–asked if we were having fun. We told him we were nervous about our latest script assignment. We were struggling with the story, the structure, the page count … basically everything. He told us to relax and assured us that whatever the problems, they could be fixed. He also–and this was most important to us–told us that we didn’t need to worry about our ten-week trial period. He believed in our talent and guaranteed that we would be around for the entire season. It was an incredibly kind thing to do and enabled us to eventually complete and turn in a truly horrid script (never used) while maintaining an optimistic outlook regarding our new writing careers.

Did you have a mentor there?

Kerry: When we sold our first freelance script, we had no idea how to get an agent. Brian Alan Lane, a writer on the show, was a huge help. He sent our material to one of his former agents. We eventually signed with this agent and have been with him ever since. Brian also gave us our first script assignment outside of "Remington Steele." Michael Gleason was also unfailingly patient in the way he worked with us. He was never too busy to help or encourage us when we needed it.

THE WRITING PROCESS

How do you two write a script?

John: We write separately, but together. We always break story together. Then we split off to write.

Kerry: With a series like "Boston Public" that contains multiple, equally-weighted stories, we simply divide the stories between us to write and then weave them together when we’re done. If the script has a strong "A" story with lesser "B" and/or "C" stories, we’re more apt to divide the work by acts.

John: After we write, we exchange pages and rewrite each other. So, essentially, our first draft is more like a second or third draft.

Kerry: We try not to have any hard and fast rules. However, because we have a tendency to write long, we try to limit our scripts (1 hour) to six major beats per act. That’s twenty-four beats for the entire script. One beat, however, might be divided into several scenes. For a dialogue-heavy series like "Boston Public" we try to have fewer scenes than pages (the scripts are approx. 48 pages). For an action series we prefer our scene count to be around one hundred, or approximately two scenes per page.

What’s a typical writing day?

Kerry: When I’m writing, whether at the studio or home, that’s pretty much all I’m doing. Deadlines are tight on "Boston Public," so I’ll get started around 8 a.m. and work until at least 6 p.m. and often as late as 11 p.m. or midnight. If things are going well, I like to take a break for at least an hour to take a walk or go to the gym. If things are going really well, I’ll see a movie in the evening and then come home and read over the work I’ve done that day. Rewards are important. When I finish a scene I allow myself 15-20 minutes to play video games, read or do just about anything that will take my mind off of my work.

John: I tend to be a "morning" writer, though I often find myself writing from morning to morning. They’re long days. I remember saying to Kerry–back when we were writing in our spare time–"just think … if we wrote for a ‘living,’ we could write from 9 to 5 and then go home." I had no idea. Another writer once said, "Writing is like having homework for the rest of your life." And I’ve found that to be true. The work is never done.

Do you outline or not? If so, how detailed?

John: We always outline. As a team–writing separately–we almost have to. So as we split off to write, each is well aware of what the other is writing, and how the pieces will fit together. The degree of detail depends on how much time we have.

Kerry: Prior to "Boston Public," we wrote very detailed outlines. Running about 12 pages, these outlines were broken down into acts and scenes. They included virtually every important piece of information that had to go into the script, including dialogue we had come up with while working on the story. This was especially helpful for John and me because we were always writing on separate parts of the script. However, on "Boston Public" we often don’t know what we’re writing until a week before it’s due. This doesn’t allow much time to do a detailed outline. In its place we create a simple beat sheet. It contains nothing more than the scene locations and the major plot point of the scenes.

How do you deal with any story disagreements?

John: I just let Kerry win. It’s much easier that way. Seriously, Kerry is far more logical and methodical than I am. When he presents his case, he’s thought it through from every possible angle. And it’s virtually bulletproof. I do find myself conceding more often than not, but it’s always for the good.

Kerry: We don’t disagree as much as you might think. When we do, we try to find a fresh solution that will make both of us happy. We might also ask an objective third party their opinion. If both of these approaches fail, whoever is most passionate (or stubborn) will get their way. If we’re both feeling especially "passionate," the person actually writing the scene/story in question will usually get their way.

What do you do when you hit roadblocks in a story?

Kerry: We think. And if that doesn’t work, we think even harder. And if that doesn’t work, we look for something to steal. Seriously. Whatever your profession, you build on the work of those who came before you. There is no story that is totally original … no story that hasn’t, in some form, been told before. If we’re stuck, we mentally review books we’ve read, movies we’ve seen, TV programs we’ve watched … and try to find a story similar to the one we’re telling and discover how its writer dealt with the problem. It’s also great to be on a show with a talented writing staff. If John and I have hit a wall on a story, there is usually someone much smarter on staff that will have the solution we’re looking for.

What about Writer’s Block? Any "special tricks" to avoid/deal with this?

Kerry: An outline is your best friend. With an outline you always know exactly where you’re going. If the outline is inadequate and I get lost in the story, I ask myself what would happen next if this weren’t a story I was creating. What would happen if it were real life? Often, the answer is boring, but it’s a place to start. A partner is also a huge help. If I’m blocked or burned out there is always the hope that John isn’t.

Any writing "secrets" you’d be willing to share?

Kerry: For most of my career I would never commit anything to paper until I believed it was perfect. Consequently, very little ever got written. I could easily spend an entire day writing one page. What I’ve learned recently is that the very act of putting words on paper seems to prime some sort of creative pump. Ideas will start to flow and I won’t have any idea where they’re coming from. Bottom line–when you’re writing, great things can happen when you give yourself permission to be bad.

I’m looking at your resume–is there any genre you can’t write?

John: I was nervous about writing for "MacGyver" at first because I wasn’t sure how I was ever going to come up with the "MacGyverisms" he used to get himself out of scrapes. But you just do it. And you get help from technical advisors along the way. Same with the law. Neither Kerry nor I are lawyers and Kerry used to say he never wanted to write for a law show. Then we wrote for "Judging Amy" and "Ally McBeal" and had very positive experiences. I feel lucky to have had the opportunity to write for so many different genres. We always try to push different concepts when we’re pitching pilots, just to show we can "paint with different colors." And mixing it up keeps things more fresh and ultimately, more fun.

Kerry: I love the fact that until "Boston Public" we never spent more than one season staffing any one series (Note: This may lead you to believe we have been fired with great frequency. We have not. Only once. I swear.). Not only did this allow us to meet and learn from many wonderfully talented writers, but it also gave us the chance to develop a wide range of writing "muscles" early in our careers.

CREATING A SERIES

You’ve also created two series: "Mr. and Mrs. Smith" and "Medicine Ball." Where did you find the inspiration for these shows?

John: The Fox network approached us and asked if we would be interested in developing a medical show (this was before "ER" and "Chicago Hope"). They said it had been a few years since "St. Elsewhere," and they felt it was time for a new medical series. Being huge fans of "St. Elsewhere," we jumped at the chance. The focus of the show was on the medical residents, fresh out of medical school. In fact, the pilot episode was Day One, their first day on the job as doctors.

"Mr. and Mrs. Smith" was an idea Kerry and I pitched to CBS. We liked the idea of two spies who spy on each other. Terribly attracted to one another, yet forbidden, by profession, to know anything about the other. It was inspired by a lifelong love of spy shows and movies, and a fondness for male/female banter. We hadn’t had a chance to write something fun like that since "Remington Steele."

How were those experiences?

John: Good, and yet frustrating. To me, getting our own show was "the brass ring." But when we got it, I found the brass to be a little tarnished. You get hit with the reality of production real fast. You’re told you can’t do what you want to because you can’t afford it. So you make compromises to make the budget. Then you get notes on your scripts–from network, studio, actors–and you make more compromises. After a while, you’ve compromised so much, you hardly recognize your show as the one you sold. Certainly not as the one you were once so passionate about. It can be very frustrating. "Medicine Ball" was frustrating for another reason. It was cancelled before anybody got a chance to see it.

Do you have a preference: writing for a show you’ve created or writing for a show you haven’t?

Kerry: Though it is an imperfect analogy, writing for a show you haven’t created is like babysitting. Writing for a show you have created is like raising your own children. With the former, you are constantly trying to get inside the mind of the parent (the creator) and raise (write) the characters and tell the stories the way he/she would. With the latter, there is less second-guessing. The characters are your own progeny. They walk and talk like you. To a certain extent, they think like you. I find it much easier, and ultimately more rewarding, to write for my own kids.

WRITING "BOSTON PUBLIC"

The two of you are currently Writers/Co-Executive Producers of "Boston Public" and work closely with David E. Kelley. It’s a show that continues to grow in popularity, both with critics and its audience. What is it about "high school" that remains such a wonderful arena for telling stories?

John: The "world" of high school is a universal one. Either you’re in school now, you were in school at one time, or you have children in school. Almost everyone has experiences or memories–good or bad–from school. They’re the "wonder years."

And yet, it must be difficult to create fresh stories every week because these shows have been so popular.

John: We find inspiration in many places. Real life. The imaginations of our writing staff. We brainstorm all the time. We read newspapers and education trade magazines, listen to radio and television news, and talk to our two "faculty advisors," who are both working teachers.

What about "uncomfortable" subject matters? Any controversial stories you didn’t want to write?

John: When David suggested we consider writing a story involving Harvard Law School professor Randall Kennedy’s new book, Nigger, I was slightly uncomfortable. He suggested we discuss the topic with Chi McBride, who plays Principal Steven Harper, to get his take on the word and find out if he’d be comfortable tackling the subject before we began writing the script. In discussing it with Chi, I found that I couldn’t say the word. I referred to it as "the N-word." Chi told me to say it. I couldn’t. He said, "you’re going to write about it, but you can’t say it?" He was a great help to us in shaping the story around his character’s opinion of the reviled word. And, though it was uncomfortable, the episode garnered some of the most positive feedback the show’s received.

What is the best "writing advice" you’ve ever read–or been given?

Kerry: Read. Words are the most important tool a writer has. If you want to write you should immerse yourself in words. Learn new ones, see how other writers use them, absorb the impact they can have when used in unexpected ways. Learn their textures, their taste, their subtleties. No one has ever learned to talk without first listening. Why should anyone expect to learn writing without first reading? Read books, read newspapers, read magazines, read scripts. Read every day. Read.

John: Our very first boss–Michael Gleason who created "Remington Steele"–was a mentor to us. We’re still quoting him. He taught us so much about writing. His personalized license plate on his car reads, "REWRITE." I asked him why. And he said, "Because writing is rewriting." I’ve never forgotten that. And it’s true. If you love writing, you better love rewriting as well. It comes with the territory.